The One Power

[Majsju]

This is for discussing everything concerning the One Power. From the nature of it down to practical weaves, and everything inbetween. So post away:)

[MatrimCauthon]

A question about taking apart a weave (like Aviendha or Elayne). The description makes it sound very physical, as if Elayne is actually holding the weave, with her hands. I just assumed this was impossible, that it was her mind that did it...

[Majsju]

I think she's just using the same words, to describe what it feels like. The actual taking apart is done with the mind, same as in weaving it in the first place.

[Nailo]

"Holding a Weave" strikes me as the same as holding a thought. It is not being physically held, ion your hands, but your mind 'holds' it tightly, which is mentally exhausting. Like relaxing concentration would allow the weave to dissolve, or at least that is how I saw the holding part of it......did that make sense?

[MatrimCauthon]

Yeah, thats what I thought, just oddly worded. Why do you think the warder bond between Elayne and Birgitte is different? Is it cos they're both women, or did Elayne not learn it 100% right? Maybe it's cos Birgittes soul has been reborn or because she was ripped out of the pattern...

[Majsju]

Well, the most likely reason is that it's because they're both women. And since Aes Sedai never heard of anyone bonding a woman as a warder before, there's obviously no research about the effects.

But one thing I wonder is how Elayne learned the weave in the first place. If you've read New Spring you know that the weave for bonding isn't taught until you're raised to Aes Sedai, which Elayne hasn't been at that point. So it might be improvisation from her part. But if so, wouldn't we've read about that when they bonded Rand?

[Nailo]

OK, I am not sure how much the two of you know about women, but living in close quarters, or if you have sister in RL but women, (without being bonded) will pick up eachothers moods more quickly, thier cycles will come at the same time, and so on. The Bond with Elayne and Brigette just intesify's the efect.

As far as how Elayne learned the weave, I kinda thought that it came on instinct, like healing for a wilder. After all she did it to save Brigette. At least thats what I think, and how I saw it.

[MatrimCauthon]

Well my knowledge of the female anatomy isn't that limited
But I didn't know that...

Didn't Elayne say something about watching Aes Sedai bonding warders when she did her thing with Birgitte?

[Majsju]

",and the two times she had watched it done in the Tower, the Aes Sedai had touched the man's forehead. The flows of Spirit she wove were complex, if not so intricate as Nynaeve's of a moment before. She barely understood some of what she was doing, and none at all of other parts, yet she had paid close attention, from her hiding place, to how the weave was shaped." - TFoH, pg 514 paperback.

Right she has seen it, but doesn't understand everything. And not understanding means that there's a risk of making mistakes.And maybe the weave should be somewhat different when bonding another woman, perhaps something similar to the Aiels weave for binding first-sisters.

[Nailo]

So here is another idea......

I was wondering what do the weaves 'look' like.

It says that the Channelers could see the weaves, and I was just wondering if they actually see them, with thier eyes, or if they 'see' them with thier minds eye....

[Majsju]

Well, I think that the weaves are "existing" in a physical sense, so they should be able to be seen with the eye. After all, it's possible to see a weave afterwards. Also, when learning how to make a weave, you remember how it's done, and I think it's more or less required to be able to see it in order to do so.

[MatrimCauthon]

Yeah, I go with Maj on this one, the weaves exist, physically, just can't be seen by non-channellers. I alwzys thought of them as just pieces of string or rope etc., like when Elayne sees the sea-folk winfinder channelling "cable thick weaves" of air. Maybe a different colour for each type, then woven together to make a weave...

[Tinker]

I have no time to try making a proof out of my thoughts, but I'll list a couple of things that supports the "minds eye".

1. You have people who can see Saidar, or Saidin or neither of them. This would indicate that the three groups of people would have physicly different eyes.

2. Halima is a male channeler in a female body. This body can only have had either the eyes that see Saidar or the eyes that can see neither of the two.

3. I can't remember if it is clearly stated, but people who loose the ability to wield the one power, also loose the ability to see the OP, don't they...
This would mean that something changes in their eyes. Nynaeve would also have had to do something about Logains eyes when healing him. I think she would have noticed something like that.

Somehow I feel that also inverted waves and the TP should speak against the acctual eye being what registers the OP.

I think it's more likely that something in the conection with half of the source, makes you able to sence this half.

(Sorry, had no time to get any structure in this post, but I think you'll understand what I mean. If something is unclear I'll try to explain myself better later.)

[Nailo]

OK, soI think I agree with Tinker's unstructured post.

I thought it was like for lack of a better word a hallucenation type of seeing. Something that is in your mind laid over what you truly see, creating the illusion that you can 'see' the weaves that no one else can.

I dont actually mean that channelers hallucenate but I remember that it looks very real, and no else can see it, so that is the closest i can come to describing it.

[MatrimCauthon]

Yeah, the weaves do exist, they are there in the physical wotk=ld, otherwise they couldn't affect it. But, it could be a visual representation in the mind of a channeller, the Eye argument is pretty good...Hallucination probably not the right word how about extra-sensory experience?!